In the mainstream media (yes, that includes us), Democrat Mike Gravel
has been portrayed as a fringe candidate, and a slightly crazy one at
that, especially after his headline-grabbing performance at last week's
debate in South Carolina.
But on the Internet, Gravel is a sensation — a refreshing face amid
a sea of cookie-cutter candidates seen as typical politicians. On
Digg.com, where users post links to articles and then let the rest of
"Diggnation" determine which stories get the most exposure, the two top
stories on the politics page in the past 24 hours are about Gravel. The
comments below each link are overwhelmingly positive.
"I love this guy. He's refreshing. You can't help but get the
impression that all the other candidates are grade school children
compared to this guy," said one poster identified as run4ny.
In another popular corner of the Internet, Fark.com, one commenter
said, "This guy has GOT to stick around. People would be LUCKY to have
the opportunity to vote for a guy who displays this kind of honesty and
courage."
In a posting on its site,
the Gravel campaign says this wellspring of online support is
responsible for pressuring CNN to invite Gravel to participate in an
upcoming debate in New Hampshire. "This invitation is a direct result
of the dedication and work of those of you who have stood up for this
campaign in the last 72 hours," press secretary Shawn Alexander Colvin
wrote.
This doesn't mean Gravel is going to move up in the polls. Many
Internet sites are frequented by people with an anti-establishment,
libertarian streak — the exact kind of people that are drawn to
candidates like Gravel and Republican Ron Paul — but they don't make up
a large chunk of the population.
However, it does look like Gravel got more than fleeting fame out of his debate appearance: He also got a base. — David Miller
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/05/02/politics/purehorserace/main2754237.shtml
Comments
ad hominem?
Submitted on May 10th, 2007 by ChupacabraGo ahead Gravel!
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by BarrosThe Gravel truth is the real inconvenient truth for the military-industrial complex...and is boys and girl... obama, edwards`s, giuliani, mcCain, hillary.
Go go ahead Gravel!
Paulo
MSNBC problems
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by ari rutenbergIn response to MSNBC's slight of Sen Gravel I wrote to Chuck Todd (Chuck.Todd@nbcuni.com) and Marc Binder(mambinder@nationaljournal.com) who are in charge of there political coverage. I asked who they were to say the Gravel wasn't a legitimate candidate and why they were fighting on behalf of the so-called front runners, who I pointed out only held that position because the media keeps covering them at everyone else's expense. Here was the response from them "Ari,
AriI'll trump you in re: a personal response.
Here's our reasoning: It was a debate; instead of exchanging ideas and pressing points, Gravel resorted to ad hominem attacks. Frankly, his message was powerful enough without them. If you were Hillary Clinton, why would you put yourself in a situation like that?
Marc"
I have not yet responded, but I thought that in addition to my response, which will not be kind given that he basically said they are on Hilary's side (I mean why else would they care about her position), all of you might want to give these pundits a piece of your minds as well. Keep up the good fight. Things are already beginning to change.
Ari Rutenberg
Ari.rutenberg@gmail.com
It's not about behavior...
Submitted on May 8th, 2007 by jflIt's not about behavior. No one on the debate was out of line. It's about describing current conditions and proposing solutions to problems.
Marc and Chuck work for a big media company which sells access to its viewers. Hillary Clinton has been and will be a good customer. He just wants to accomodate a good customer.
In Marc's view it's as though a regular diner in his restaurant, a big tipper too, one who regularly meets with associates in his place to touch base and quietly cut deals finds herself seated next to a table of people from a competing company.
She calls her boy Marc over and says, "Marc, you've always been such a dear, but I can't continue to come to your restaurant if those people are allowed to sit in the same room with us." Marc says, "I'm terribly sorry Ms Clinton. It will never happen again."
This is not business as usual. Hillary and Mike are not just two cut-throat competitors for a piece of the action in the real estate market. They are trying to reach the people of the United States of America, to lay out the very serious condition the country is in, to present their respective plans to remedy the problems that face our Nation. Ok, Mike is anyway.
MSNBC does not own the venue. This is the people's business being conducted in public. Hillary Clinton cannot have Mike thrown out because she would prefer not to have to deal with the issues he brings up, would prefer that an alternative to her tightly packaged discourse not be presented.
MSNBC is clearly on the side of the big-spenders. That's why they judge a potential client's worthiness by the amount of money he or she has to buy commercial TV time to "sell" their audience, by how good a client the client's been and will be.
It is time for Americans to rub the sleep from their eyes, to wake up and smell the coffee. Politics has been reduced to just another profit center, to just another line of business by the MSM. They feel that it's their game and they'll run it as it suits them and their best customers.
There's no reason for us to let them get away with this any longer. MSNBC and the other MSM companies are manipulating an enterprise for purposes of engaging in, concealing, or benefiting from a pattern of racketeering activity, namely that of limiting the choices of candidates for a public office to those both willing and capable of buying airtime on the MSM.
This is actionable under the RICO Act and we ought to pursue it.
Ari...well I just responded...
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by eleonaiHey Ari,
I just sent this to "Marc"...
Marc,
I really don't care what your personal opinion of Senator Mike Gravel is, or care about your desire to "defend" Hillary Clinton against his statements. You're a journalist...report the damn news. You can start by including all the candidates who were at the debate in the polls. This includes Mike Gravel.
Eli,
Iraq Veteran
Journalists
Submitted on May 8th, 2007 by mkangasVeteran Eli could not have said it better.
It all is so simple:
Most in news media (two exceptions) should stick to the news and how to deliver it. We here want information, not the opinions of people who do not comprehend what they are delivering.
Regards,
MK
Re: MSNBC
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by BigMike"Ad Hominem" attacks are when you ignore the substance of a person's policy viewpoint, and instead just attack their character.
When Gravel said "these guys scare me" and "who are you going to Nuke?"...he wasn't making an ad hominem attack---he was directly referring to the imperialist positions of all the other mainline candidates.
However---when Brian Williams asked "Shouldn't the race be for serious candidates only?"----THAT is an ad hominem attack. Likewise, when Chris Matthews was like, "Senator, where have you been for 35 years?" that too is an ad hominem attack. Because, instead of focusing on the substance of Gravel's vision, they simply wanted to dismiss him b/c he hasn't been a candidate in a long time.
Power to the People! Power to the People! Vote for Mike Gravel...Power to the People, right on!!!
Clinton's stealing Gravel's ideas
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by vkrnI noticed over the weekend that Clinton, in her usual snarky sneaky way, is stealing Gravel's idea by now
<a href="http://blogs.usatoday.com/onpolitics/2007/05/clinton_joins_b.html">Clinton's sneakiness</a>
(I don't know if the above link will turn out pretty, but read about Clinton's latest popularity move...)
Clinton voted for the Iraq war even though there were at least 21 senators with the same information she had, who opposed authorizing it at the time.
She's been a do-nothing follower until now, until after she's witnessed the insistent chant from the masses: GET OUT OF IRAQ NOW.
So in true sneaky pollster-driven fashion, she's co-opted Gravel's essential idea and expects us to herald her as our new savior. She has NO MORALS.
These supposed so-called "top-tier" Democrats, AKA spineless worms, make me SICK!
GRAVEL, you have my support! I've donated $500 and I want you to win! I wrote to those media hacks because I want your voice to be heard!
You're the only truth-teller out there!
BTW Eli, stay safe. I heard that the Army has clamped down to prevent soldiers from blogging or posting about Iraq.
Thanks VKRN...
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by eleonaiThanks VKRN,
I will. The rumor you heard is true. The only reason it's not more enforced is because they lack the resources. Whether that changes...who knows. But, I am not alone. Thanks, From Iraq,
Eli
Go ahead Gravel!
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by BarrosKeep it simple...talk the truth!
Go ahead Gravel!
Best regards from Portugal
Paulo
Maverick Mike Gravelhe's my
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by Andrew ColeUnintelligent Response
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by Tantroo_McNallyAll your base are belong to us...
What? I'm only human. And that was so open for that.
Even if we should fail, let the ideals live on.
The internet is still
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by Van BurenThe internet is still untouched. A pioneer of sorts. We all have an equal chance and say on the internet. So this is good news! And they are watching. Its starting to show. Keep the work up Mike stick to your guns, and Mike's supporters keep up the great work on getting this word out.
Fringe, try Middle America
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by Tennessee for M...Although it is certainly nice to have some attention from the likes of CBS, they are still missing the point.
The average Middle American is doing more with less and less each day. We see our jobs being shipped overseas, we watch as politicians talk of terrorism and yet the Chinese army could march across the border and not be seen, all the while granny is getting strip searched on her way to play black jack in Vegas. We are getting taxed into poverty which has risen for the 6th straight year. We watch each fall when we are told that gas prices are going up because of winter fuel oil demand, only to hear them say in the spring that gas prices are going up because of the driving season.
Our children can barely string together a sentence in English or calculate the interest on their mortgages. They take their chances of getting shot to pieces just getting on a school bus each day only to get to school and be told they need to be medicated until they drool out of the corner of their mouth. Our youth are growing up in a world where we have become so politically correct that in some instances we can not keep scores in games for fear of hurting their feelings when they lose. Their first experience with the concept of accountability will be when they start their first McJob.
Meanwhile we watch our government take us to war without end, a perpetual war in which our President has taken great liberty with the liberties of the people. An unnecessary war that will continue to drain the life out of this nation and stain the desert crimson with the children of people that no longer have a say. We see them, the politicians, stand before us, polished and smug, talking about a people they no longer even know. So detached are they from the realities of most Americans lives that they still think the Middle Class own summer homes in San Diego.
When you in the press speak of “fringe”, you should be referring to the American people. Yes, Americans know what they want, we want our country back, we want a say and we want the truth. Those who are on the internet know already and this is most evident to anyone with a computer and soon to be known by those without. We are sick and tired of the same and more of the same from the department of redundancy department. To all you news types, to all you cookie cutter politicians, it is you who are on the fringes of the real America and we are going to vote you off.
Nice
Submitted on May 7th, 2007 by nosecohnWell put. One thing to add:
"Maverick" does not equal "fringe." Don't let the mainstream media paint Mike as "fringe" just because he speaks the truth, or because not enough people have heard what he has to say yet.
The founding fathers were mavericks.
Amen...
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by eleonaiAmen...
From a Soldier (I mean free corporate mercenary) in Iraq, who is getting ready to come back and tell people what is REALLY going on here. The lid is getting ready to come off.
Eli
Tell it like it is!
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by BigMikeWhat is up with Blackwater? Is it true that our government is paying those guys $200,000/year to do the work that should properly be done by a U.S. Soldier? Is it true that Blackwater guys get better equipment than those of you who signed up to fight the old fashioned way (i.e. in the United States Military)?
I am glad Senator Gravel is talking about the Military-Industrial Complex. I have no first hand experience in these things--but I have to imagine that Blackwater is the epitome of that.
For those of you who don't know what I am talking about, click here to read more about Blackwater.
Senator Gravel should consider a pledge to eliminate all mercenary forces from our military operations. I wonder if he could get the "politics as usual" Dems to go along with him? I wouldn't count on it...
The Blackwater security and
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by PeterMThe Blackwater security and other such organizations are just an insignificant drop in the bucket in the Military Industrial Complex.
The "meat" of this Military complex are weapons manufacturers and all supporting industries and publicly subsidized corporations. The Carlyle group, the Boeing, the Raytheons, the ship, missile, tank, rocket, nuclear, aircraft, ammunition, electronics corporations and the financiers that feed this monster and the POLITICIANS on both sides who sit on the arms services committees etc.. who DEPEND on this and do all in their power to PROTECT this RACKET.
It is this symbiotic relationship that is destroying this country.
Mercenaries...and such...
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by eleonaiBIg Mike,
Blackwater is only a FRACTION of the "mercenaries" that are operating here. You have no idea my friend, and neither do the American People. They are contracting "security" jobs over here to new "Security Consulting Companies" every day. The companies in turn use military forces to provide the "support" (the most dangerous parts) for their missions, while they use better equipment, drive nicer vehicles, and get paid, YES, WELL over 6 figures a year for doing THE EXACT SAME JOB as we are trained to do. The military actually sent me to Blackwater (again paying them an UNGODLY AMOUNT OF MONEY to teach me things that the army already knows, by prior Army guys), and I was then sent back to an Army unit with Army pay. What's sad is that the facilities etc at blackwater, were better run and more efficiant than anything I've ever seen in the military in my 8 years. They have let the Army deteriorate, while lining the pockets of these private corporations. I'M JUST GETTING STARTED. The worst part is the lies Mike. THE LIES. You have no idea my friend. Blackwater is only a small fringe element of the extortion that is taking place. Remember, "Blackwater" is only a security group which allows for other things to take place. My job (Protective Service) is very much the same. We see things, Mike. We see things.
Eli
Watch your words and your back
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by ElliswonderWow
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by BigMikeWow. Eli, that is some powerful stuff. And the American people need to know!
Stay safe. And then come back home and Tell It Like It Is!!!
Senator Gravel should... eliminate all mercenary forces
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by jflSenator Gravel should consider a pledge to eliminate all mercenary forces from our military operations.
Yes he should! Do you mean he hasn't?
Mercenaries...
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by BigMikePolls indicate what, exactly?
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by elimisteve"However, it does look like Gravel got more than fleeting fame out of his debate appearance: He also got a base."
"This doesn't mean Gravel is going to move up in the polls."
If it's possible to go from having no base to having one without moving up in the polls, then what exactly are the polls measuring?!
Poll listed on MSNBC
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by judgesudsMoney = TV
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by jflYou nailed it judgesuds. This was the means used to eliminate a debate between Jonathan Tasini and Hillary Clinton during the Democratic Primary in NY. What does a candidate need all the money for? TV time, of course. What defines a "real" candidate to a TV station? One with plenty of money to spend on TV time.
The gatekeepers are now running politics as a profitable line of business.
Like sports. More like Professional Wrestling. Like the Prison System in Texas. Like Homeland Security. Like the war in Iraq.
These guys are so corrupt that they can't even imagine what a real, square system would look like anymore.
Mike Gravel is our last, best chance. If we can't elect him we'll never have a chance at another.
Off topic
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by judgesudsFirst they ignore you, then they ridicule you
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by jflThis doesn't mean Gravel is going to move up in the polls. Many Internet sites are frequented by people with an anti-establishment, libertarian streak — the exact kind of people that are drawn to candidates like Gravel and Republican Ron Paul — but they don't make up a large chunk of the population.
Well they've moved from ignorance to ridicule pretty quickly, don't you think? They still think they can convince us that we don't exist by means of their polls. How amusing.
Mike Gravel... Hello...
I have been alerting people on other blogs that you are about to publish draft legislation to "Fund the withdrawal of all American troops from Iraq within sixty days of its passage, and to fund only that withdrawal", as you yourself proposed in an interview I read right here.
The sooner you are able to put that draft on your website the sooner we can all cut and paste it into emails and snail mails and send it to "our" Senators and Representatives demanding that they pass it.
This is not just our one and only way of expressing our desires and demands to the War Criminals in Washington DC in a concerted fashion, but by virtue of your having drawn up the draft it makes you the defacto leader of the antiwar movement and thence of the Democratic Party, as the fight to pass the legislation is realized.
We look forward to your victorius stride into the White House on 20 January, 2009, Mike Gravel. But we cannot wait until then to end the war. This war is an unholy holocaust that must end now.
Being the man who ended the war in Iraq is a very good argument for making you President of the United States.
I know that unlike the "top tier" Demoplicans you do not view a continuing war in Iraq as a political asset and a Republicrat liability.
Awesome, Mike. I hadn't
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by trailfootAwesome, Mike.
I hadn't heard of you before the debate, but was watching and you said that line about the only thing worse than soldiers dying in vain being more soldiers dying in vain, and I realized that in a conversation with my family about the war and possibility fo withdrawl I'd used those exact same words. So I hopped on Wikipedia and Google to find info about you, found this site, and... wow.
You're the first candidate who's actually excited me. Before this, I was planning on voting for John Edwards as the most likely to break from mediocrity of the people I knew anything about. Now, though... campaigning tirelessly for you.
You have my support, such as it is.
Glad to have you Trailfoot
Submitted on May 6th, 2007 by Mainer4MikeMike is the real deal. He's speaking truth to power. He's the candidate with a backbone -- and the one with the passionate group who has had enough of politics as usual. Mike's a breathe of fresh air to a suffocating electorate. We've been waiting for this for decades -- If you can handle the truth -- it's Gravel all the way!